Transcription:
Ruth Fisk: (
Good afternoon. My name is Ruth Fisk. I'm the Vice President of Insurance Strategy at Smart Communications. And we're sponsoring this track today, rapid digital transformation. This is our third session and really one to be excited about. So we're glad that you're stayed and are joining it. And we've learned a lot about innovation over the last couple of days. And as we look to transform our companies, as we look to meet the customer's expectations, this session's really focused on. It's not too late, how to start or catch up with the transforming peers. So with me today, I have the moderator, Keith Raymond, he's the senior annual analyst from Celent, and he is joined by a lot of industry experts that we're pleased to have on stage as well. We have Aviad Pinkovezky...
Ruth Fisk: (
I knew I would butcher it, and he is president of First Connect along with Hippo Insurance. We've got Jason Barg, he's the partner from Lovell Minnick Partners. And then we also have Todd Teta, the chief product and technology officer from ATTOM Data Solutions. So we're really looking forward to a great conversation. Awesome. Over to you, Keith.
Keith Raymond: (
Thank you so much. Hi everybody, my name's Keith Raymond. I am from a company called Celent. We're a global research and advisory firm and I work in our insurance vertical and focus on north American insurance in particular. So glad to be here and like to give everybody here the opportunity to introduce themselves. So Aviad...
Aviad Pinkovezky: (
Thank you. Great to be here. Aviad Pinkovezky, I've been with Hippo for six and a half years started on the product side was the chief park officer at fi of Hippo, which is a home insurance company. One of the InsureTech startups that have grown in the last few years and recently been the president of First Connect, which is a Hippo subsidiary focused on providing market access and technology tools for independent agencies across the country.
Jason Barg: (
Hi, I'm Jason Barg. I'm a partner at LMP. We're a private equity firm that focuses on investing in financial services and financial technology companies. I spend a lot of time with our, with our companies in the insurance services and insurance technology space. A number of our investments include Adam data and to introduce the company and himself Charles Taylor, which is in the insurance services space and technology, national auto care and auto warranty business, Warner Pacific, a general agent and historically we were in other kind of insurance, brokerage and insurance service investments.
Todd Teta: (
Yes, as Jason said, my name is Todd Teta with ATTOM Data. We are a data and information business that collects and curates well over 500 different data sources targeting the insurance home services, mortgage and real estate spaces. So all things around a property and a neighborhood that become risk factors in how you guys underwrite or power your platforms or make decisions within your to day to day businesses. So, Adam Powers a lot of the various inure techs that are out within the industry.
Keith Raymond: (
Fantastic. So we have an interesting points of view up here, right? We have agency slash insurance point of view with first connect in hippo. We have a investment point of view from partners, and we have a data point of view from Adam data. So, hopefully this will give you guys a great swath of perspective from the standpoint of digital transformation and title here is it's not too late. And if you're in the insurance industry, I guess it's never too late. Especially I cover property casualty and life and annuity for the most part, but I've done many years in healthcare as well. And, there's a, I talked to insurance carriers on a very regular basis and it's very interesting to note that everybody's at a different spot in their digital journey, right?
Keith Raymond: (
There's no one group that's I would say the forerunner and there's nobody really bringing up the rear so to speak everybody's on a different part of the digital journey for a different reason. And what we've seen is a literally a tsunami of investment happening in digital insurance in general, over the last, I'd say five years so well before. COVID and just, COVID kind of lighting the fire if you will, to advance the digital journey even faster than it was going before. And so it's not too late and avid let's talk to me about where your first connects investments are, how digitally focused they are and what are some of the challenges that you're focused on resolving from an industry perspective.
Aviad Pinkovezky: (
Yeah, thanks. So let's separate our two layers to this question. The first one is on the hippo side and the focus of people has been on first of all, modernizing the way in which customers are able to get home insurance, basically meet customers where they are, if a customer wants to buy online, direct people was among the first ones to actually offer this kind of ability for customers to get quoted and to buy a policy online within just a few minutes. That's one part being an omnichannel ability to go direct but also at the same time being in front of customers when they're calling to an agent or when they're in the process of getting a mortgage or buying a house from a bill embedded insurance. So that's kind of a big pillar of our strategy about omnichannel approach for distribution that is enabled by both business development partnership, as well as by technology, because you can't do it without API and technology and the ability to quote and place your the binding of the policy in a seamless way.
Aviad Pinkovezky: (
The second part of the hippo strategy and differentiation is how to change the way people think about insurance from being a reactive service. That basically makes you all again, when something bad happens, turning it into a proactive service that again, use technology and services in order to help homeowners to take better care of their home by using technology smart, such as smart home devices. And so on, on the first connect side, the vision that we have is how to take independent insurance agents that are driving a huge part of the insurance market in the us. The commission that they make based on several studies is about 50 billion a year, just commission earned by independent agents in the us. And now to make sure that this segment of the insurance industry is being able to serve their customers by having a broad market access, as well as access to technology tools that helps them to get the best solution for their customers to increase monetization retention and so on. So those are kind of the two dimensions, the two layers to answer this question, awesome.
Keith Raymond: (
Todd, data and analytics is a huge part of digital transformation. Where is Adam looking from the standpoint of digital capabilities and what are the challenges that some of the challenges you're trying to solve
Todd Teta: (
For? Yeah, absolutely. So I think, I'd frame it similarly in two different buckets. The first is just access to information, access to data. There's a lot of information that's very sparse out in the market. It might only apply to a particular line or a particular type of in our world, a lot around properties. So, individual states maybe only have access to a particular set of data. So what we're spending a lot of time on is trying to democratize the data and driving more access on a national footprint because without that it's difficult to drive workflows. The second area that we're spending a lot of time and energy innovating on is around consumption. So the days of delivering data come in from a data background for many years where you kind of throw it over the fence and let a consumer use that data in any which way they can.
Todd Teta: (
But kind of on their own is changing. So Avi avid mentioned APIs as a primary delivery vehicle for which you guys do. That's a big part of where we innovate and spend time on new consumption patterns around that but also cloud based delivery of information. So, many insurers, many ensure techs and many of our customers in general are looking for new ways to access data. That's not necessarily transactional in nature because it's actually difficult to build analytic models on a, or tools, frankly, even on data that's only available through APIs. So, we've spent a lot of time and energy over the last couple of years focusing on delivery and consumption of data so that it's easier for our customers to use.
Keith Raymond: (
Cool. Well, they didn't tell me we were gonna use sunscreen up here, but Jason from an investment perspective, , lot of startups, a lot of more mature insurer tax out there, and a lot of just generally mature businesses out there. What do you guys look for when it comes to or do you have focus from a perspective of digital capabilities in the companies you're looking at innovation in those companies? What are your optics and what are you looking for from the standpoint of your investments
Jason Barg: (
When you're making? Yeah, thanks. Keith, it's good. Good question. So, we're in probably the more mature part of the ecosystem as opposed to sort of the startup area where we tend to invest in companies that have been around for a bit of time, but they're still growing very rapidly. And as we think about the landscape and we often look at it through the lens of what others in the ecosystem need especially on the carrier side and try to find the interesting companies that could benefit from some of those tailwinds. Adam's a great example with some of the data consumption that we feel is of in increasing interest to carriers. And it certainly, I think a lot of where carriers have focused historically in this space has been on the front end and developing the sales pipeline and thinking about data as it plays into that workflow, but also data as it can feed into other areas, be it on the service side or claim side.
Jason Barg: (
So that's an area of interest for us, I think increasingly and especially in this market with this market backdrop, where we see the potential of a recession or people at least talking about a recession in the coming year, there will be a lot of opportunities we believe for ensure techs to have increasing role in that scenario. So for example, I think there's a lot of insurance companies thinking about, okay, how do you wrap your product in with, within other ecosystems? So if it's home insurance, how do you wrap your home insurance product in with the actual real estate transaction and as things are happening in real estate and in mortgage, there will be increasing opportunities with those types of firms to seek their own revenue opportunities from seeking those kinds of partnerships. So those are some of the things that come to mind for me, Keith.
Keith Raymond: (
Great. Thank you. Thank you everybody talks a good innovation game. How about that? Everybody talks a good innovation game but what's your philosophy on the speed of innovation and how does that translate for you to time to market?
Aviad Pinkovezky: (
You know it's a good question. One that reminds me kind of the early days at hippo. Yeah. When we started building hippo, like it was early 2016, it was pretty much an early stage technology startup. And the expectation in the valley was like, you need to build something fast, like an MVP, minimal viable product to you need to put it out there and get traction. And if you do it right, maybe we'll get you funding. But the problem is that insurance doesn't really work this way. Like, what does it mean to build an MVP in the context of insurance? Does it mean that we build a hormonal solution with coverage J but not coverage C or maybe one deductible, but not the wind deductible, because it's the MVP. So what does it mean and how we can make sure that your executives are not going to jail?
Aviad Pinkovezky: (
When it's a regulated product that you need to get approved to sell selling. So it doesn't really work this way. So it took us about a year and a half to build the product until we went to market which is not really a typical kind of a Silicon valley show, sorry, Silicon valley start up experience. Right. But it worked out. We actually raised our series a before we were live before we actually had the attraction. But after that, the opportunity and the challenge was to keep moving fast, but not to cut corners on stuff that matter. So for example, in areas that are regulatory sensitive, such as underwriting rating, rolling out into new states, we made sure to take out time. It still took like weeks or months, which is probably way faster for those project compared to what the industry is usually used to but it was still taking time.
Aviad Pinkovezky: (
But then for the other stuff, the customer facing the agent facing distribution play, we started to work in a two weeks increment in sprints when we are trying to release like new features and new capabilities every other week to the tax stack and basically to move fast. But the distinction here is what can we do in this way in an agile, faster market way, and which areas of the product and of the technology are too sensitive and too risk. And we need to take our time in doing that. We created several separate tax tax to enable that. So there won't be too much of interdependency between the different organizations and also at like different teams. This is also one of the reason why we, when we started to invest in first connect, the company that I oversee now we have our own technology stack and team and so on. So we can actually move fast, regardless of some other more sensitive, slow moving part. That is part of the hip product that is regulated.
Todd Teta: (
Yeah. If I could jump in on a little bit keys, cause I think Tim mentioned this in one of the earlier sessions when he was talking about the Guidewire implementation. And I think it's a carry on move fast but fail fast as well when you fail. And don't invest too much. That's something that we espouse pretty heavily in our business is to try to keep the cycle short, to your point and make decisions quickly that, if something's not working, we don't have the luxury of testing as much because it's not necessarily a consumer facing product line. But regardless of that, we still try to fail as quickly as we can when we do have problems like that. So I just thought I'd throw that in. Yeah, no, cause I think it's relevant and I, it resonated when Tim said it. Yeah.
Keith Raymond: (
Well, TA I'm gonna keep you talking. So customer experience is kind of seen as the sexy area of innovation these days, right? Everybody's talking about customer experience and even on our own surveys from standpoint of carriers C our CIO surveys, our annual survey we talk and ask the questions about, what are they most focused on and customer experience over the last two years has been in the top two each year. So from that standpoint and that digital journey and transformation, what about data helps make the transformation from the standpoint of improving this CU not only the customer experience, but the sales process, backend processes, you know, increase value in that value chain from the standpoint of overall experience. Yeah. Where do you guys go?
Todd Teta: (
Yeah, absolutely. So, I'd say a comment Jason made earlier about a lot of the use cases we would've seen around data historically, were revenue focused. So whether that be in the marketing side of the equation or in underwriting or sales itself that was where bigger budgets were. And a lot of the spend ended up happening in the early days of adoption for data within the insurance base. And I should say, obviously insurance has been data based from day one, right? Actuarial science is based primarily on that. But we're talking, what we see from a use case standpoint is an expansion of the use of it, our data and other data sets, third party customer data in driving back office operations. So whether that be in policy side or in the claim side, which has been a big area of growth for us, there's been a lot of demand there.
Todd Teta: (
And what we typically see is companies using data for content enrichment, if you will. So enriching information that they maybe have within the shop already about consumers or policies or risks. So they're enriching that with other third party information or using it to develop analytics. That's a, obviously been a big theme over the course of the last couple of days. And that's increasingly becoming a use case that even small tier carriers and other insurers are starting to look at which is driving our product roadmap. As I mentioned earlier.
Jason Barg: (
Can I add on to that for my own kids? So, we hear a lot about data when we're looking at new investments and the companies are talking about how they're using data or how the data that they have already can be monetized. And I think one of the challenges that we see a lot of companies in the space have is they don't, they feel like the data's at their fingertips, but they don't know exactly how to use it or how to monetize it. And then the O the other side of the coin is finding the right kind of third party data to that interfaces or integrates well with the systems that they have, which is also can be quite cumbersome if there's a lot of legacy systems or whatnot that exists in at a carrier or elsewhere.
Keith Raymond: (
All right. Jason, I look back five years ago or so four or five years ago, or so I used to at least pre COVID. Anyway, I used to facilitate some trips out to Palo Alto with the senior executives, it executives, and we'd go to the plug and play and visit ABC D round funded companies just to give the senior executives the feel for what's going on in insured tech space. And there was a lot of money being pumped in those years, a lot of money being pumped in now, the, the economic dynamics have changed a little bit over the last, uh, year or so. Uh, and more recently, probably the last few months, um, is from an inure tech perspective, risks opportunities. Where do you see the, the industry right now?
Jason Barg: (
Well, I, I think there's always risks and opportunities stating, stating the obvious. Um, you know, if you look at last year, I think there was about 15 billion that flowed into in, in shore tech. And that had been double what flowed in, in, in 2020. And, um, what goes up must come down at some point, I suppose. Uh, and you know, this year is, is a bit different. Um, you know, once the public markets trade off, I, I do think that sort of cascades into the private markets. It takes, it takes some time for, for it to happen, but, um, it looks like it's happening and it's, it's, it's going to happen. Um, it's going to continue to happen for, for some time. And I don't, I don't think that that's a particularly bad thing. I think that, you know, for, for those that, um, had had a lot of, a lot of companies received a, a lot of solid funding in the past handful of years, given how much money flowed into, into this vertical and, and other verticals, you know, when you think about operationally, the, the insurance space is among relative to other sectors of the economy.
Jason Barg: (
The insurance space is a pretty resilient sector. It's not all that cyclical. It's not really that a discretionary spend. and therefore there will continue to be a lot of demand. And it's one where I back to some of the earlier comments that I made, I think that other sectors like the mortgage sector or the real estate sector that may have more cyclicality to it that do have more cyclicality to, it will probably look to develop new lines of revenue by jumping into things like the insurance space, how do they get, how do they get into selling insurance products into those adjacent areas? So that probably presents some additional opportunities. So there's certainly risks. The capital markets show us that there's risks, but there's a lot of opportunity. We think in this kind of market environment,
Aviad Pinkovezky: (
Just to add one, yeah, go ahead. Quick observation. It's worth keeping in mind that most of the traditional large incumbent insurance companies have been around for decades, if not more than one other deal, centuries C exactly. And the InsureTech companies that have been around for the past few years are basically approaching this industry and trying to do what was done over decades. Yeah. In a much shorter amount of time. So this is why volatility is almost expected as part of it, because you can't do that without creating a very interesting dynamic in the market because yeah, it's not always moving in the right direction, but again, you're trying to compress something that has taken like decades, if not more into a few years, by using technology and fast iterate iterations. And, it's going take some time, but I think it's pretty obvious that a lot of the well funded insured companies that are treating this business as insurance business are definitely going to be tomorrow's incumbent and tomorrow's big players,
Keith Raymond: (
ABI. I'm gonna have to read this one off the one we talked about before, cause its the long one beyond the better customer experience, how has digital direct relationship with the customer allowed you to change value proposition at hippo first direct either by enhancing the policy itself or by delivering new and complimentary kinds of value?
Aviad Pinkovezky: (
Yeah. So one of the challenges with insurance and we talked about a bit it earlier is that it's a transactional product. It's a transactional service. You basically pay your premium to the insurance company. You get paid when something bad happens, that's pretty much it. So you can't really build a solid deep relationship due to that. And this is also probably one why so many insurance brands are so generic and so similar to each other because you can't really get a lot of substance into the relationship. What we are doing is taking a bit of a different approach and seeing how insurance could be a proactive service that helps you to mitigate in this case home and to make sure that small problems don't become big claims. And the way to do that is around insurance technology and services.
Aviad Pinkovezky: (
So on the insurance side, we actually took a stab and we built our own policy product pretty much from the grounds up including specific coverages for how people live their life like home offices before COVID, before it was trended like discounts for smart home devices, coverages that are more modernized. And so on. We also started our home insurance our home protection device plan, where we provide our customers with complimentary smart home kits, which allows them to benefit from additional discounts. And it's not only about shipping the devices, this is part of it, but it's also about how to bake in the discount into the policy to make sure that it's approved by the reg by the regulator, then to build the technology back and to make sure that we are notified once the device is on or off so we can keep the discount.
Aviad Pinkovezky: (
So there is a lot of work behind it and the result has been pretty stellar. I think it's the biggest program of its kind in the us. We this is one of the big driver for why we have a premium of attention rate of about 87%. We shipped over 750,000 such devices to our customers. And it's one of the pillars in our strategy about how to create deeper involvement and engagement by the customer. And now to throw a bit of a tease, we are experimenting with a mobile app that is supposed to take this engagement to the next level, by marrying together the insurance policy, the small home devices aspect, and also the home services, which is the complimentary leg of this channel that allows us to actually help the customers to take better care of their home and to address small issues before they become big claims.
Keith Raymond: (
Todd, I mean ABI odds hitting on everything data, right? Yeah. How is data really helping move the needle on digital transformation from your eyes?
Todd Teta: (
Yeah, absolutely. Well, I think it obviously it's foundational and we've heard that the last couple of days. But I think the noise factor around data and broadly more broadly analytics is pretty high too. There are a lot of data that you could conceptually put into the ecosystem Avi odd was talking about. But sorting through the noise of what's truly indicative of risk or an opportunity or pricing indicators is a really challenging problem. I think for any company that's trying to do this. So if there were one, I guess, word of advice on anything around data and how it might fuel digital transformation is choose partners wisely. That's probably pretty obvious and then make sure you're, you have the right talent in your team to be able to assess that there's a lot of failed data projects out there.
Todd Teta: (
There's a lot of failed transformation projects out there. And I think getting your arms around that first, before you embark on it's important, I'm intrigued too by one of the things Avi mentioned with smart home and it's kind of a tangential issue but smart home monitoring. We obviously we have leak bot in the exhibit hall there showing their leak detection installations. One of the challenges that I think is gonna happen over the coming years is a lack of standardization of how that information's actually collected, shared democratized both across the industry and even just in a captive ecosystem, like you're talking about, um for you to support five or six different types of IOT interfaces with is a problem that really doesn't have any customer value. It might have value for the manufacturers of the equipment to be nonstandard, but for what we're all trying to accomplish, it's actually a barrier. So I'm hoping that over time, things like that get standardized open data initiatives, GA get gain more hold and then it becomes easier to really do what we're trying to do over the next couple of years,
Keith Raymond: (
Avi everybody's talking about digital direct, right? And a lot easier to pursue when you're on the property casualty side of the business than is on a life side of the business, unless we're talking about the simplified products, right. So where do you see digital direct going in the future? How will things evolve?
Aviad Pinkovezky: (
So I think digital direct is one of many options. Yeah. And you know, it's interesting because when we started building he back in 2016, the main hypothesis was the direct is gonna be the future. And we actually built people is a director, consumer mindset and the design, everything that I personally worked on was with the consumer in mind. And then when I still remember this it's a funny story. But when Rick recently became our CEO joined us in 2017, he is an industry veteran. And one of the first things we did when he joined us was to get a bit of agents from his network to kick the tires and to take the product that we just built out for a spin right to test drive it. And they basically started to use it with their customers and go to some traffic.
Aviad Pinkovezky: (
We were able to identify some bugs allegedly, fix the issues get some feedback and everything was good. And then we came back to the agent, we said, Hey guys, thank you. Here is the commission, thank you for your service until next time. And they were like, no you can't take it away from us. Apparently they fell in love with the consumer great experience that we built and they wanted to keep using it. And that was a big aha moment for us because what happened was that we realized that first of all, agents are in demand for, you know, customers are actually calling the agents all the time and it's not going to change any anytime. Soon, second, we realized that agents are also people and they actually like easy to use intuitive products that allow them to serve their customers more efficiently and more easily. So we actually started to build a whole new suite of product under the hip umbrella to serve those agents, to serve this customer base. And then we also acquired first connect, which I'm currently overseeing. So it's a shameless plug.
Aviad Pinkovezky: (
But, that's kind of the aha moment. And I think it actually goes deeper. We realize that one of the unique value propositions that we have at Ebo because of the technology stack we have is the ability to meet the customers where they are. So the agent was one use case. Another use case was the builder partnership that we launched with now to begin with, which has been our fastest growing most profitable line of business, where as a new home buyer, who is buying a house from a builder Le now in this instance you are being provided with the insurance quote together with the home quote because of the data integration because of the stack integration that we have with Le. Now we are able to ingest all the characteristic of the property and to ensure it to spec before it's broadly available via other data providers, because the house is still being constructed.
Aviad Pinkovezky: (
And that's a very interesting kind of embedded insurance that is being driven by technology, which technically is not exactly direct to consumer, right? But it takes the technology that we build for consumer and presenting it in a, in an embedded way in front of customers when they are in a need to buy insurance, because let's face it. Most people don't wake up in the morning being excited about, okay, today I'm going to shop for home insurance. It's usually a show you need to check because you're in the middle of buying a house or something like that. And then the important thing for us is to be there when the customer and where the customer needs to get insurance.
Jason Barg: (
Awesome. Can I piggyback on that comment for a moment? I think it's a great insight about using the technology for to empower agents and empower brokers. And it's very similar, I think about like the wealth management space with all the robo advisors that existed years ago. And there were probably 50 of them direct to consumer plays and what it really did. I none of the couple of them took off or did okay. But what it really did was empower financial advisors to say, okay, I need to put technology into my offering. And you can look at the same thing in the real estate space or the mortgage space and insurance, which is from a technology standpoint is probably a little bit behind those other sectors. It's the same kind of thing where most people, when they're making a large, complicated decision, they want some advice, they want some human advice, but what the some of the direct to consumer plays do, is it really facilitates or encourages all the agents the people involved the distribution people to embrace technology.
Jason Barg: (
It forces them in that direction, which is really healthy.
Keith Raymond: (
So we got time for one more question, and then I'm gonna leave the last few minutes for any questions you guys might have out in the audience. So hopefully have a few but guys and Todd, I'll start with you look in your crystal ball. And I know the next three or so years is, sounds like a long way out. But where do you see digital taking the insurance industry from the standpoint of capability wise?
Todd Teta: (
Yeah, absolutely. I mentioned the one thing about standardization. Yeah. I think that's important. I think organizationally the other thing that I'm hoping for and looking for is, I guess, institutionalizing this automation question. So I think a lot of companies have put forth initiatives and spent a lot of money on it. But if you go back into say the eighties, nineties, and two thousands whether it be six Sigma or lean, there was very strong methodologies around how you do in those cases, productivity, um or software development, there's a pure methodology around it. And this question around automation, what do you automate? What don't you automate and how do you do it? I'm hoping that there's innovation and just the process of methodology around that, which I think will be very helpful for companies to adopt as things go forward.
Todd Teta: (
Real specifically in my world. One of the things that I think is a really interesting and very likely case here is more use of video in all parts of insurance. Today you guys hear you see in the hall, a lot of imagery companies, photos, satellite images going into looking at things like roof condition on a home. Those are all really powerful technologies for today. But looking at video content that many companies have just sitting in their shelves around maintenance around deferred maintenance on commercial buildings, right on something as esoteric as a storage, water storage tank, video footage of that and how it could indicate policy risk for somebody ensuring that company. I'm really looking forward to that particular thing. So we're kind keeping an eye on that and all the insights that that could drive. So those probably the big ones in my mind. Yeah.
Keith Raymond: (
Avia, how about yourself?
Aviad Pinkovezky: (
So now I think it was mark TW, you said that making prediction is difficult, especially about the future. Yeah. So, I try to take a risk on this one, but I think there are two trends that are interesting. The first one is the apparent of embedded insurance, which we just talked about which is enabled by the fact that more and more industries are being digitized. Because if you have like only one industry that is digitized, you can't really have the API based integration with other players, but all of a sudden you have like mortgage lenders, refinance, lenders builders, and so on. So you have this ecosystem that can create this kind of mishmash of network and partnership and so on that can create different opportunities that were just not available before. And second, I think it, again goes back to a point we talked a bit about earlier today, which is how insurance can evolve from only a reactive service into something that is including more services in order to provide added value and people customer engagement. So, for example, home services that allows you to take care of your home, to prevent claims or an ability to place leak detectors in a very seamless fashion and to benefit from a deeper discount and so on.
Keith Raymond: (
Yep, Jason,
Jason Barg: (
Well, I agree with the comment about the dangers of making predictions, but a couple things that would come to mind for me is I think that the industry will accelerate in its maturity. I think that, just my own world capital markets, I think that shifting the shifts in the capital markets kind of force companies to mature, it probably reduces the number of companies, but makes those that are successful larger. I do, we believe that data is really poised to play a pivotal role. Especially if you look outside just the front end of the kind of sales process and more into services and claims, how does data get involved and, and both AI and machine learning into those into those processes. And I think generally though Avia, your comment about this insurance companies have been around for centuries. It's a effectively a business model that is built on unpredictability. That's what insurance companies are solving for. So I think it's actually, for that reason, it's somewhat, it's difficult to predict exactly what will happen. There will be things that pop up here. And I think the only thing that we're really confident in is that there will be continued innovation throughout the sector.
Keith Raymond: (
Well, awesome guys. Thanks a bunch. And I know I wanna open up, we have a couple minutes left. Is there any questions out there you guys wanna ask this fantastic panel and speak loudly? Oh, we have a mic.
Audience Member 1: (
So with all this innovations going on with the intro tech, so after you get the technology down, and it seems like there's all the traditional problems with insurance still exist. So how do you think this innovation is going to solve, you know, ever selections and fraud, etcetera and will actually the technology going to solve those problems?
Keith Raymond: (
Anybody wanna take that one?
Aviad Pinkovezky: (
I would say that technology is a mean to an end. And the way we look at that at hippo is that we are an insurance company and we are in the insurance business. And the people that we recently hired were hired as industry veterans that know how to use technology to solve those problems better. And, you know, it, I believe this is a big part of why, we've seen the performance improvement in the publicly available results that we shared with the street, because we are treating it as an insurance business. And yes, it's volatile. It's unpredictable. This is part of the game, but technology can help you solve this problem by getting more data feeds into your system, making sure that you are using the data more effectively, that risky properties don't fall through the cracks. And so on
Keith Raymond: (
Over
Audience Member 2: (
Here, you had a question. So we are talking about data, data, privacy, data sharing across partners. And when you are embedding insurance products, you obviously have relationship between your cloud provider, the software vendor, the data provider, how do you navigate third party risk management when you got the procurement team, having it say the cybersecurity team, having it say, and the chief data officer worried about is my data gonna leak out? How do you navigate that?
Todd Teta: (
Yeah, I'll take that. So I think the first thing i awareness of what your rights are on data. If you're building an ecosystem play to your question making sure that the appropriate agreements are in place for you rights to do that with a consumer, with your partners, whatever it might be. And then just, there's a whole probably panel we could do on security around data or actually probably a whole conference, right. I'm sure. Those there are very targeted topics, but what we're big on is making sure that information is used for purpose not stored for, you know, the stake of storing we don't store anymore than we need to. And we don't distribute it beyond any walls that we need to.
Todd Teta: (
So we kind of keep a closed ecosystem around any data that we take inside of our shop. And I think as businesses in general, get more connected with partners and ecosystem and consumers that mindset starts expanding. There's a concept in computer science, the power of the network is you start adding nodes. It becomes increasingly complex. So I don't, I don't think that problem's gonna get any simpler anytime soon, but it's that walled garden approach that we tend to take and recommend that our customers think about,
Keith Raymond: (
Well, we're out of time, give these guys a big hand. They were awesome. We're here every Thursday, come back next week and we'll see you later.